The Karen versus Ellenore Debate
I’m not sure how many readers realize that there are a half dozen people who contribute to this site. You can see who wrote what at the top of each post. The cool part is that we don’t always agree on what happens on the show. Here’s one such example of a disagreement Emilie and I had over IM after tonight’s results:
john 10:53 pm
i wish ellenore was gone and not karen
karen would be more interesting on tour
emilie 10:54 pm
NO!
i thought you liked ellenore
i don’t think so. you’re so wrong.
john 10:54 pm
i also can’t help but wonder how ellenore’s family background might have affected the judges
emilie 10:54 pm
she’s AMAZING!!!
she has so much personality
john 10:54 pm
i don’t really dislike her…just not a huge fan
emilie 10:54 pm
blech.
john 10:54 pm
plus we have enough of her style on tour
emilie 10:54 pm
no we don’t!!!!!
she is SO unique
no one dances like her.
john 10:54 pm
well, it’s not like i dislike ellenore. I like her, but I would have just preferred karen on tour
Of course, emilie wants to be validated;-) So, here’s a poll for you to vote on who you’d prefer to see on the SYTYCD season 6 tour (since the SYTYCD top 10 get to go on tour usually):
Ellenore is my favorite of the girls and pretty much has been since Vegas. And I loved her solo. It was like one of Jeanine’s solos hooked up with one of Ade’s solos and they gave birth to Ellenore’s solo, lol.
I was quite relieved when Noelle/Russell made it through, because I knew there was no way the judges would send Ellenore home. Mollee would probably be safe as well, and Karen would go.
I don’t dislike Karen, but I feel like she’s gotten weaker over time instead of growing, and I really wouldn’t be very excited to see her on tour.
ahs,
We’re no longer friends;-) The good news is that you just became best friends with Emilie.
Ahh, sorry John. Smooches to my new bff Emilie, please call me every 10 minutes! lol 😉
(psst… hate to say it, J, but you seem to be rather outvoted!)
sorry john, i’m on team ellenore as well. it’s not that i disliked karen, it’s that i just love ellenore. she’s quirky and somewhat strange, and i agree with mary that she’s something we havent had on the show. i’m sad to see her partnership with ryan end, but intrigued to see what could happen if she’s paired with another contemporary/jazz dancer, much more intrigued than wondering who karen would get for a partner.
i was kind of over nigel’s overpraising of karen, and it seems as though america was, too. i dont think we warmed up to her as much as the judges wanted us to. the only 2 weeks that karen hasnt been in the bottom were the weeks that the judges picked the bottom 3 couples, i think that says something. i’m super excited to see ellenore on tour, and i suspect we might be seeing karen as well, since they often bring the 2 eliminated tonight as swings. i think last season with caitlin and phillip was a unique situation because both of their partners made top 10 and they wanted to be able to put “mad” and caitlin/jason’s bollywood routine on the tour and thats why they were billed as “special guests”
Ahs,
She even gets smooches? *shakes fist*
Looks like I am outvoted. My opinion of the sites readership just took a plunge;-)
Margaret,
Nigel ruined Karen with his perv comments.
I’m not a fan of either, but the only reason Karen made it this far was because she got to “be sexy”. She was by far the weakest dancer (in terms of technique) out of the remaining 6 girls.
As for style, I don’t see what Karen would bring to the top 10 that Ashleigh wouldn’t.
Karen’s problem was that she was stuck with weak partners, and it brought her down. I loved to watch Karen dance and would have loved her to stay on the show. I would switch her with Mollee in the top 10 in a hot minute. Looking at their solos it was a choice between desperate and “meh”.
Happy Thanksgivigin! It’s been a while since I’ve posted; The season has been rather lackluster for me…
I actually wanted both Karen and Ellenore to stay and was hoping Mollee would go.
I like Ellenore’s quirkiness but actually the advice she received from the judges was probably the most helpful. “connect with planet earth.” I mean we know she’s out there, now she needs to relate to the common ppl 😛
I liked Karen too because I thought she was a strong dancer but didn’t have a strong partner. I wanted Mollee out earlier and Victor just didn’t contribute anything to any of the dances sadly, so I could see Nathan and Karen together.
Karen’s personality and work ethic was something I noticed throughout the show and I was really hoping she was going to be in the top 10. It’s just unfortunate that the strength in the sexiness department was overshadowing her dancing in the judges eyes but I thought it really added some flare to the routines. Dancing is all subjective really. And I think it was mentioned that women wouldn’t vote for her because they feel intimidated (which I’ve read is true on some blogs).
This is where the guest judges come in handy. There’s no real prior impressions other than what you see. Although they aren’t there along the journey, they can view a dance for what it is, and not necessarily biased on their opinion.
phew…what a paragraph. This was an interesting thread. Sorry but I can’t vote for either that I like more. I liked them both and felt they had an equal chance of getting as far as they could. Can we have a I like them both option? 🙂
and @Nina:
Totally agree with you. I can’t imagine Mollee dancing with Ryan…>_<
Welcome back Christine. Interesting take. Although, I must admit that I was glad that Mollee stayed. See my post on blondes for possible bias there;-)
I like the idea of another option, but it’s more fun to see you have to choose between 2 difficult options;-)
Doesn’t anybody think that Mollee should have left last night? I think she is too immature still.. Both Karen and Ellenore should have made it through.
I’m also surprised that they kept Nathan….he’s kinda in the Mollee category for me…..
I am very sad that Kevin is gone….he was one of my faves for sure
John, I’ll give you smooches, too, if you still want them from me, lol 🙂
The thing about Karen is… unless I’m just forgetting it… we never got to see her in a contemporary, and for me, I really need to see them do contemporary to really judge them. I know her movement in the Broadway piece was painfully blah. And I know she never stood out for me in any of the group routines. (Ellenore did, Mollee did, and -though I know she wasn’t bottom 3- Noelle really did, she kicked ass in that “statues” piece.)
I think coming down to the top 10, I’m excited to see everyone switch partners. I’m hoping for awesome performances now that everyone can dance with someone else.
I really can’t imagine what performances the judges are going to pick for their favorites because I haven’t seen any that captured my attention. I have a few, but I’ll list my pre-top 10 favs on another potential thread that John and his team of bloggers will post in the future 😉
oh yes… Now that we’re in the top 10, perhaps, Karen and…..someone else…Peter? will be the swingers? *crosses fingers* I forgot about the people who got cut already to be honest 🙁 including the tappers. I actually want Pauline there, but Karen should be there I think in case Ashleigh gets injured or something… >_> I haven’t seen any outstanding female contemporary dancers absolutely kill it in latin ballroom yet. Kathryn maybe?
John, i actually completely agree with you, nigel really hurt karen with those comments. i also agree with wanting to have seen karen do contemporary, just as i wish we could have seen kevin do contemporary, i think there is a chance it would have changed people’s minds. btw, ballsy of nigel to tell nathan that he had voted to send nathan home, maybe that and getting a new partner will light a fire under nathan, who knows.
Needs to be two polls.
One for guys, one for girls. 😉 For complete disclosure I voted for Karen.
Meanwhile, is it me or is there some tension between Adam and Nigel on the judging panel, seems to be a little bit of cross talk, and whenever the camera cuts to Nigel he never seems happy about it – Shankman always seems to interject something when others are talking…
Also there seems to be a little off about how Adam and Cat get along too, the other nights “aye” was a good example, where he repeated it and was shut down.
Smooches from ahs!! Yay!! ;”) Christine, I’m excited to see new couples, too, as sad as I am to see some of them split up. John and Margaret, I do agree that Nigel hurt Karen, but I still prefer Elleanore. And Ashleigh now. 🙂 I’m glad y’all liked this thread. I kinda forced John to do it after our disagreement last night. Lol.
I haven’t read through the comments yet, but I’ll throw in my 2 cents about Karen.
From a production and tour angle, if Karen made it to the top ten, she’d have nothing to do on the tour. All her partners from the previous weeks didn’t make the top ten. In addition, given her lack of popularity with voters, it’s doubtful she would have made it past the top ten week. From this angle, it would have been very hard to justify keeping Karen for the tour.
As for my own opinion, Karen has always been “meh” for me. Her audition didn’t impress me, and I didn’t really care for her work in the show. She’s not my type of girl either, so the so-called “sexy” factor that Nigel kept harping on didn’t pull me in. And to me, it seemed like she had difficultly transcending the sultry persona. And, I thought her second solo (the one to rock music) was god awful. She reminded me of a drunk girl at a bar trying to get attention.
Ellenore, on the other hand, is quirky and memorable. I adore girls like her (my girlfriend is really quirky as well :-), and she’s fun to watch. She’s done some great stuff already with Ryan, such as the Sonya piece, the Travis piece, and the Spencer Liff broadway. That’s the kind of stuff I want to see on the tour. She may be contemporary, but she’s not generic. She’s one of the dancers I know I’ll remember from this season.
So yeah, Ellenore all the way.
Oh no! I voted for Karen instead for Ellenore thinking that it was “Who would you rather see eliminated?”.
I just can’t seem to appreciate Karen for what she does. Ellenore just seems to bring so much more personality to her performances each time and she doesn’t take a wrong step at all in her dance.
Karen, on the other hand, just doesn’t seem to bring brilliant performances. I’ve never once watched her performances and went “WOAH” or gasped.
So, for me, I would definitely prefer Ellenore.
Yes, smooches from ahs. Just don’t tell my wife;-)
I guess the other thing for me is that I think that I really like some of the more raw dancers. I agree that Ellenore is unique in her solos, but I don’t really like her in the couples routines.
Oh well, what’s done is done, but I’d still rather see Karen.
John and Emilie, I feel like I should use my first name, now that we’re becoming friends! lol 🙂
James G., very good point! I hadn’t even thought about it that logically, but you’re right. I think all the other dancers already have a few pieces under their belt that could be done on tour, but I can’t think of what Karen would do.
Wondering about that, how much interjecting of swing dancers into couple dances they weren’t originally in is done? When I saw the S4 tour, it happened a few times (ex. Katee dancing the Katua Broadway piece with Thayne instead of Joshua, which was odd). When I saw S5, I don’t think it happened at all. Just wondering.
@Ahs and James G:
I already know she doesn’t have any dances under her belt 🙁 It was just a thought to get her there lol.
If anything Pauline and Peter might be there just for the Wade Robson routine (never know) but they won’t have that awful huge backscreen to distract and will have to hide behind some large piece of cardboard and improvise. Plus if they brushed up on that quickstep routine I wouldn’t mind seeing that. Plus we’ll have the token tapper. ;D
Or maybe they’ll have Channing and Victor there to do their birdcage routine? To be honest I can’t stand Victor’s dancing. Even in this routine he lacks a connection with his partner. Channing was absolutely fab in that routine though.
Rawr! Or maybe they’ll just cut back on the budget and just not have any swingers? *shrugs*
@John:
Well since Karen is no longer in the competition, who are you voting for to win?
(this question should probably be polled for everyone actually…now that we’re in the top 10)
swings mostly come in case principal dancers get injured, during season 3 lacey was injured so shauna did some of her dances. but sometimes top 10 dancers fill in for each other, during s4 kherington did the door routine with twitch because katee was injured. interestingly, this past season phillip was injured during 3 of the last 4 cities (fresno, san jose and portland) but they simply put in other routines instead of “Mad”, though he did come out for the Russian folk dance gags.
ellenore has at least 3 memorable dances so far while I can’t really think of one of Karen’s I’d like to see on tour.
I’m really interested to see how the dynamic changes with the partner switches. it’s clear pretty quickly how the audience feels, and it can be dramatically different than during the first 5 weeks of the show. s3 1st 2 gone from the top 10 were kameron and jaimie, both well loved at first by the audience, s4 was pretty shocking when kherington got knocked out along with gev, and s5 wasn’t quite as shocking when randi and kupono were sent packing.
Ellenore is awesome. Would have preferred to see Karen on tour rather than Mollee but I guess the younger audience buys more tickets?